And we would also measure the ability to breathe, the volume.
How fast and how big was the breathing volume?
So we could measure that.
Then, so you could combine qualitative
research with a quantitive research.
Now in general, what, in general,
this kind of form of music therapy lends itself mostly to qualitative research.
Meaning the participant, the subjects can describe
what they're experiencing before the session,
during the session, after the session.
And then you can write it up in a qualitative description, or
you can make interviews before you start the treatment and
in the end of the treatment.
>> You know, Freud was renowned for his use of case studies.
>> Yeah. >> For example as a way of explaining and
learning to understand what was happening in therapy.
And the case study tradition is still very popular in analytical
music therapy too isn't it?
>> Yeah, it is because you can describe both the clients' music.
You can transcribe the music exactly, so
you can actually see the graphic score of the music.
And you can do the same thing for the music therapist.
And you can transcribe what they're saying in
relation to the music before, middle and after.
And you can also understand the process.
So let's say you describe a case description from session one,
session five and session ten, and
you can compare the content and see how it's changed.
Or you can learn something about interventions and how they emerge and
why you can talk as a music therapist and why did I do this intervention.
What was the purpose of that?
Or what is the purpose of this suggesting
the person to breathe into her harmonica.
Or what was the experience?
You can talk in the case study about how was my
experience as a therapist in relation to the client so
that the student can actually maybe understand the impotence
of that it's important what you experience also.
Don't only have the attention towards the client but also towards you.
Techniques, variety of message, teaching a variety of message,
leading regression, reality rehearsal, whatever you want.
And describing it in case studies so people can learn from that.
>> Yeah. >> And
I think that that's just as important as any other form of research.
>> Thank you.
>> In general, it does lend itself mostly to qualitative descriptions.
That type of music.
It's not counting how many beats per minute the person is doing on a drum.
It's not counting, it's about the process.
>> Yeah.
>> That's important, the process and maybe also the product,
but particularly the process internally in the client
as well as the process between the two people.
>> Yeah, thank you.
That is really great because it's important to understand that different
ways of musicking with other people lead to different forms of understanding,
and that there isn't one that's more important than the other.
But it is important that they're suitable.
So, Freud had a huge influence on the development of this
approach as well as some of those that came after him.
In your opinion, what are the key ideas that you see,
musically being used in therapy sessions that you run.
>> Well, Jung was a lot about images, and archetypes and
connecting to the individual unconscious but
also the collective unconscious.
So, what I work a lot with is the ability of music to elicit images,
and have the client figure out what the deeper
meaning is of the occurrence of this image at this
point in the session in relation to this theme.
So fantasy, detours and both connecting with
their own personal images in the deeper meaning but
also collective unconscious and also helping them to
transfer what we are experiencing of this is the meaning of that symbol.
How can I transfer that to the outside session?
That I use a lot and that's Jung basically.
Now Freud making the unconscious conscious.
Helping the person to form music.
Like when they started themselves in the sessions,
some people don't like to be video taped.
But I usually video tape my sessions so
that we can go back and look at them together.
And they can study their own unconscious behaviour, or
what they said, but we can't remember they said that.
So, using the video to identify the unconscious behaviour,
and also to understand through deep listening
again and again through their music.
What are their emotions that leads them to be sad or
angry or happy or not happy or whatever.
So Freud's ability to bring up to surface drives
the emotions and understand why they are there.
What are their purpose?
And I also do a lot of working on processing nightly dreams and
Freud was an expert in dream interpretation.
So here I'm using musical processing to go
back into a person's dreams in a variety of ways and
then I have them identify, what does this music mean?
What does it simple, we may play about a scary bear or
a big cliff that the person has to jump from.
What deeper meaning, emotionally, does the music reflect that this dream
is telling them, so that they develop their own interpretation universe?
And so that a lake might mean sadness for somebody but
it might mean happiness for somebody else.
So that they understand that when they get in touch with symbols or
see some things that they have their own, develop their own interpretation universe.
So this whole thing about interpretation.
>> Yeah.
>> Mary Priestley talks about an oral music, or
music that's denotal, or
music that reflects different developmental stages.