What do you think resonates and causes people to be so attracted to nonviolent action, even for yourself? What got you attracted to seeing this as a legitimate path for social change? >> Well, one of the things that inspired me was when I saw what Martin Luther King was able to accomplish in Montgomery, Alabama. And that was a very violent situation. I mean, his home was bombed. Abernathy, Ralph Abernathy's church was bombed. That was his cohort there. And people just experienced all kind of rage. And in spite of that, Martin Luther King was able to prevail, even in Supreme Court, to desegregate the local buses there in Montgomery. And I was very much impressed with the fact that he was able to succeed in 1955 with that decision. And I found this was a better way to approach the segregation, which is another form of violence towards individual. There's systemic violence and there's physical violence. The physical violence is only a symptom of the systematic violence that exists in institutions. So unless we address those kind of forms of violence we'll always see the overt type of violence that occurs. But I was inspired because I realized that this was certainly a much more effective way and it was able to bring about change. And on a moral basis, it was not in me to bring harm or discomfort to other human beings just for the sake of seeing people suffer. I didn't like that, okay? That was not my nature to do that. I had a different kind of values. So, it fits right in with my own personal values. >> Wow. >> And then I saw the masses of people, and I felt really good about that. >> Well, that I think resonates with a lot of people, who in this day and time are searching and looking for something to have a connection to, and some way to try to positively impact the world. You talked a lot, just recently, about Dr. King and yourself and Ralph Abernathy, and the work that you all did. And from a leadership perspective, I just wonder for this generation that's maybe watching this and listening to this. What kind of things would you suggest to them in terms of concrete measures that they could maybe borrow from the past, to help them on this road to nonviolent social change? >> Well, the first thing that I would recommend is that young people have the opportunity to experiment with nonviolence at an earlier period in their lives. In fact, it can be role play. It could be fun. I enjoy working with young people. I did a fifth grade class up in Rhode Island at one of the local elementary schools. And what we did was teach the children that they must be creative and they must have, you know, take the power in their own hands. They don't have to live with violence and bullying in their community. That they had responsibility to make sure that their community was a safe community not only for themselves, but for other people. And that they had that responsibility. You couldn't look for an outside force to do that. And once I trained them in nonviolence, you'd be surprised how creative these young people became, fifth graders. They decided that the next time that an incident would occur, like on the playground, and there was a fight that would break out. On their own, they decided what they'd do is form a circle and hold hands and surround the people who were involved in the conflict and start singing the National Anthem. It would be difficult for people to fight each other and you're singing this song of unity of our country, and the spirit, and everything else. So it worked, and they found out that the music had a lot to do with changing the mood of people. They hear things and they're people who hear things, and that's why they behave the way they do. And psychological studies show that people are affected more by what they hear than any other sense. So what we have to do is create the right sound. And I really feel that nonviolence is a sound approach and if we can get the right mood, okay, people would be willing to reexamine their own behavior. And it certainly has a great influence over how people feel towards each other. Music is also healing. When the people were beaten up on the bridge in Selma, Alabama, knocked to the pavement, and not only those who were knocked to the pavement but those who you had to watch be hit by billy clubs, run over by horses, older women like Mrs. Amelia Boynton. Sometimes those pains and discomforts are even greater than receiving them yourself, to watch others suffer. But what did they do? They returned to the church. They had Brown Chapel in Selma, Alabama. They sang We Shall Overcome. That's determination and it's also healing.
